Bad design

I have been running in KSO's for about a month now. These shoes have a terrible design IMO. There is no protection to the right of your big toe on the right shoe and vice-versa on the left. If your big toe does not come down on the "sole" part and slips to the side of the other toes your big toe just constantly grates on the fabric and the surface. There's nothing to ensure it stays within the toe "pocket." A rather terrible design and a regretful purchase. Passable for walking but not for running whatsoever. I will be recommending anyone interested in these shoes to pass on them.
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Comments

  • I apparently have not encountered the issue you are describing as I am having a hard time envisioning it...

    Sorry they did not work out for you though.

    Michael
  • Here is a photo to better understand what I mean. The red line illustrates where the sole for the big toe ends. A portion of my toe is coming down on fabric. When I initially put the shoes on I ensure that all my toes are securely in each toe pocket however, as I run in them my big toe pulls into the other toes so to speak. I also was sized and the size above was too big and the size smaller caused my toe "knuckles" to bend.

    2luxhk2.jpg
  • I also don't have this issue...sorry for your troubles.


    leaves
  • I think you got a duff pair - my KSO's do not look like that - you should simply return them and ask for a new pair - then I am sure you will be happier running in them as I am
  • on 1268773665:

    I think you got a duff pair - my KSO's do not look like that - you should simply return them and ask for a new pair - then I am sure you will be happier running in them as I am


    How do yours look? The bulge you see in the big toe pocket is my big toe.
  • What does the bottom of the shoe look like while you are wearing them?  It almost looks like the sole and the toe pocket were not aligned properly when it was glued.  My big toe is rather fat and it doesn't hang over the sole like that.  I only wear them for running.
  • can you take a picture of the bottom?  Here is a stock picture of some classics.  The toe looks the same on the KSO's.....

    vibramfivefingersclassic.jpg

    Here is the KSO...  (from Vibrams site)
    large-kso.jpg

    There is just no room on the bottom for your toe to hang over....
  • i have that problem with a pair of classics, with the big toe sticking out a bit.

    I think it's a duff pair, another quality control issue.
  • on 1268776846:

    What does the bottom of the shoe look like while you are wearing them?  It almost looks like the sole and the toe pocket were not aligned properly when it was glued.  My big toe is rather fat and it doesn't hang over the sole like that.  I only wear them for running.


    Difficult to get a good shot but here's what it looks like.

    nz3tab.png

    No different that the photos Ive seen of other KSO soles. I don't believe it was a construction error, it is the fact that there is nothing to keep your big toe from slipping out of the pocket. On the outer side of the toe the sole curves upward providing a nice "wrap" to keep it from sliding out. On the inner side there is nothing but light mesh material. The sole stops and creates a drop off, this is why I think its a poor design. Photos below to show what I mean. Note: they were not on my feet in the next two photos.  

    qnablg.jpg

    2cwo8qd.jpg

  • on 1268779400:


    There is just no room on the bottom for your toe to hang over....


    2luxhk2.jpg

    I don't know how to illustrate better that my toe does in fact hang over.
  • This is the first time I've seen someone's large toe "overhanging" its toe pocket like this before. The toe proportions in your top view picture just doesn't seem quite right, but the bottom side seems ok. Is it the same on both sides?

    It may also be that the shape of your toes just does not suit the VFF design, the big toe seems to curve inwards. Everyone's feet are different after all :), so it's hard to make an average foot shaped shoe.

    If you don't mind, a photo of your bare feet may be quite informative. If your toes curve in a lot, you have the choice of returning your KSOs, or allowing your toes time to spread out which may take a few months.
  • this is interesting... i haven't logged a ton of miles yet, but i do get a slight amount of toe overhang like you describe (right side of the right big toe, and vice versa on the left).

    based on the wear on the bottom of the big toe, so far it doesn't look like it's going to be an issue for me, but only time will tell. my worry is that eventually my big toe will be making contact with the ground.

    i've attributed it to the fact that not all feet are the same, so i just happen to have a slightly wide big toe, which means it doesn't seat perfectly in the toe pocket.  unlike you, mine don't hit the ground directly, so it's more just grating on the fabric which is ok.
  • on 1268781107:

    This is the first time I've seen someone's large toe "overhanging" its toe pocket like this before. The toe proportions in your top view picture just doesn't seem quite right, but the bottom side seems ok. Is it the same on both sides?

    It may also be that the shape of your toes just does not suit the VFF design, the big toe seems to curve inwards. Everyone's feet are different after all :), so it's hard to make an average foot shaped shoe.

    If you don't mind, a photo of your bare feet may be quite informative. If your toes curve in a lot, you have the choice of returning your KSOs, or allowing your toes time to spread out which may take a few months.


    Here are my ugly feet

    4lrmlj.jpg

    Now that I am looking at them it does seem that my big toes do curve inward. I thought there is only a 30 day return policy for the FiveFingers? Do I have another option to return?

    Regarding the threads in my above post. I still don't think its a construction error I think I just have feet that don't work that well with these shoes. It is still disappointing to me that Vibram could not create a more wrapped pocket for the toes.
  • I now agree that your KSO are probably normal, it looks like you toes are the cause! You could check the return policy with your retailer.

    A third option: KSO Treks have a better shaped sole which may help you toes avoid contact with the ground.
  • on 1268783334:


    Haha I was just on Terra Plana's site. Would probably be a much better purchase. Sounds like a company that makes quality products as well. Unfortunately they are out of stock until April.
  • on 1268782874:

    I now agree that your KSO are probably normal, it looks like you toes are the cause! You could check the return policy with your retailer.

    A third option: KSO Treks have a better shaped sole which may help you toes avoid contact with the ground.


    I purchased them directly from Vibram. They have a 30 day return policy but only if the shoes are unused and in their original packaging....burn. Rather unpleasent experience thus far with this company, still don't plan on recommending them to anyone anytime soon. In fact my fiancee was going to purchase a pair in the coming weeks. I will be steering her towards the Terra Plana Evo's
  • Yea, looking at the bottom shot, those KSO look normal...  Your big toes curve in a lot!  No offense, but that is bizzare, I've never seen that before.  That is a real bummer on the return policy.  I'm glad I never had a problem with my VFF and have logged over 400miles in my classics so far.
  • cinderella problem;  the same (mold) of shoes can't be expected to fit every feet perfectly..  

    a friend of mine has rather humongous big toes;  it looks like they are about to burst out the toe pocket on both sides.  But there was no alignment issue and so far he's totally happy.  

    I'd still say give Vibram a try. I've talked to them several times about defects and they've been receptive and fair. Sure, yours doesn't look defective, but showing them the pictures may convince them how the shoes are just not right for you (and that you may not realize this fit problem right away..)    Alternatively, selling them on EBay or something to recover most of the cost is also fairly straight forward.

    On the other hand, I wouldn't nec deprive your fiancee from the amazing VFF experience simply because their design doesn't fit you quite right...
  • on 1268786957:


    On the other hand, I wouldn't nec deprive your fiancee from the amazing VFF experience simply because their design doesn't fit you quite right...


    Theres other company's that provide an experience like FiveFingers, and after reading this article (http://barefootrunninguniversity.com/terra_plana_vivo_barefoot_evo_review.html) it sounds like theres better experiences.

    And its more than just the design and more than just me ...

    https://forum.birthdayshoes.com/birthdayshoes-com-general-discussion/vff-defects!/
  • on 1268787707:

    on 1268786957:


    On the other hand, I wouldn't nec deprive your fiancee from the amazing VFF experience simply because their design doesn't fit you quite right...


    Theres other company's that provide an experience like FiveFingers, and after reading this article (http://barefootrunninguniversity.com/terra_plana_vivo_barefoot_evo_review.html) it sounds like theres better experiences.

    And its more than just the design and more than just me ...

    https://forum.birthdayshoes.com/birthdayshoes-com-general-discussion/vff-defects!/


    so, the evo's seem like a good alternative, but like the reviewer mentions... $160 is a pretty good chunk of change for a shoe that is meant to mimic not wearing shoes at all... i thought $85 was a lot for my KSO's! i don't think i could swallow $160, unless i didn't have a choice (such as your situation).

    bottom line is that IF the VFF's fit your fiancee, why not save some money and go with those?  there are a lot of people on this site that love them.
  • on 1268787707:


    Theres other company's that provide an experience like FiveFingers, and after reading this article (http://barefootrunninguniversity.com/terra_plana_vivo_barefoot_evo_review.html) it sounds like theres better experiences.


    A review of the VFF's from the same site refers to them as "the current gold-standard by which all other minimalist shoes are measured."  http://barefootrunninguniversity.com/vibram_five_fingers_kso_review.html

    I stand by my and others comments of sorry it did not work out for you, but I would not say it was at the fault of the shoe.  Why deprive others from the experience because they did not work out for you?  Ultimately it is your choice of course...

    Michael
  • Quote from the Evo review

    "I think it is the best minimalist shoe available as of March 2010"

    And I stand by my comment that I think the design could be improved.

    Why buy a product from a company that has a known quality control/defect problem? Now that I am aware of it I plan to make others. Granted my issue was not a defect but my issue is also a risk to any potential buyer.

    on 1268789216:

    Ultimately it is your choice of course...


    Exactly
  • on 1268787707:

    And its more than just the design and more than just me ...

    https://forum.birthdayshoes.com/birthdayshoes-com-general-discussion/vff-defects!/


    You don't need to tell me about the defects; I am the one who initially pointed out a couple of the major defects on this board. 

    That said, I owe 6 pairs and have given 4 pairs out as gifts and converted at least 7 friends to them, and are eying for more.  Took me months and months to find the right fit/good pair.  But as I said, the VFF experience was worth it for me, despite all these issues. 

    I was merely pointing out that your particular "bad design" complaint wasn't terribly warranted; others may still enjoy them tremendously.  But as you said, it's your choice...
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